November 23

[Anonymous]

Originally Posted by Opium

WOAH! DS9 is Trek, but it is Trek-PLUS. It's Trek plus good drama, it's Trek plus CSI or ER or X-Files. It's Trek-PLUS. PLUS it makes it cool.

Enterprise is...Trek: The Prequel. TTP is just that...a forerunner to Trek, but made afterwards. To compare the Ent to DS9 is like comparing the Original Star Wars trilogy with the Ewok shows :wink: Okay, maybe that's a bit harsh. It's like comparing Original Star Wars to the new one, which included Jar Jar Binks and that wierd aging thing were Natalie Portman stays the same as her boyfriend ages about 12 years.

Right on. You can't just dissmis other treks as being (not real trek) just because they're newer. Personally I think that TOS doesn't really fit with the newer instalments of the franchise. Same with enterprise.
Enterprise also shows that people can't do retro scifi anymore. Enterprise would have been cool as a Daledus class ship. That type is more raw, more old fasioned yet still more advanced then anything today. But instead they just made a cool new ship which was a poor choice. It doesn't look more advanced then voyager or DS9 or even TNG but its way more advanced looking then old school trek ships.
Same with the new Star Wars movies. Everything looks superior to the original star wars. The ships the weapons. Maby its suposed to show that the rise of the empire had a degrative effect on technology but I think its just lack of creativity on the part of the creators.

[Anonymous]

Originally Posted by persianmouse

Gee, when did playing a flawed, complicated, and compelling character become a bad thing? T'pol is not a traditional Vulcan, they've never played her as a traditional Vulcan, she's...a little nutty. And I really don't see anything wrong with that. Human beings aren't all the same, why should that be true for vulcans. She has some emotional problems (and from way before the whole trellium-d, that was a symptom of her emotional issues, not the cause), and bally-hoo for TPTB for showing that in the future, people still have issues. And yes, she's Vulcan, but there were bound to be Insane, mad, eccentric Vulcans out there. It would make sense for her to be one. A vulcan living on a human ship, forging new ground, being an explorer, a revolutionary, is probably not gonna be someone who never rocks the boat. Now I'm not saying I approve of her drug habit, but that's the thing, you weren't supposed to like it, that story-line was supposed to piss you off, nobody is going 'yay for drugs!' over there. She was inadvertantly addicted to a substance she was initially exposed to through no fault of her own, and once she realized that this was no longer 'social drinking', that she had a problem, she stopped, and she got help, and she hasn't relasped. That is strength of character right there, to not go back, it's not easy.

Oh, and about the whole eating with your hands thing and picking up other human habits, here's a little lesson anyone who's ever taken a Sociology course should know; When a person goes and lives with another group, another culture, they begin to pick up small habits of that culture, even subconsciencely. An American goes to Europe for a few years, they come back smoking their cigarettes like a European, calling an elevator a 'lift' and eating scones. Or you go to Japan, and start taking you shoes off when you walk into a home, and bowing slightly when shaking hands. It's the natural flow of things, to adapt to new surroundings, to become part of the pack. So therefor, T'pol would probably pick up a few habits, like eating with her hands, or saying 'thank you'. She's not rejecting being Vulcan, so she eats with her hands, whoop-piddee-freakin-doo.

Most of this is just because she's Vulcan, and there is a misconception that you can define that into one particular set of rules, and if you deviate from those rules in any way, you cease to be Vulcan. No one has that kind of predjudice when it comes to humans on the show. Define what it is to be a Human being, give me a set of rules and social mores and cultural ideals that all humans have, and if they don't, then they are not human. Can you do that? When Trip does something, does anybody ask "Is that something a Human would do?" No, they ask "Is that something Trip would do?" whenever T'pol does anything the first thing said is "that's not something a Vulcan would do" T'pol is not just a Vulcan, she is a person in her own right with her own flaws and attributes, her own ideas and principles.I think it is good of the writers to write a race on star trek like it is an actual race, with differences, and varients and devience. And yes admittidly, there is some T&A for no purpose other than T&A, but that's everywhere on TV, it's like commericals, and it should not distract you from the overall story.

It's often said that strife and conflict on the set creates something really wonderfull on camera, so i don't care what dumb-ass things Jo wants to say, so long as she stays with the show, and portrays T'pol as well as she does.

-c.

I think that since Vulcans are a different race entirely they're rules of differences should be different from ours. Vulcans probably apear very different to other Vulcans. Likewise to Vulcans we all apear the same. Tovok says it himself. Thats how Vulcans have been made out to be.
I think originally T'pol was a great character. Now she's kinda gotten dull. The old becoming human thing is getting dry. Instead lets see humans become more alien. Maby they shoud meet a socially superior race and becme more like them.

[Anonymous]

Woops just so you guys no those Guest ones are mine

[NAHTMMM]

Originally Posted by Alexia

You, my boy, need to stop beating yourself up everytime you miss an update! The world doesn't end if you miss one you know :wink:

Believe me, it is. I've met a lot of wonderful people through this site, through you. You, Colin "Zeke" Hayman, are a wonderful person. Cheer up :wink: Misery does not suit you :wink:

It would matter if you gave up on updating full stop. I personally like the daily updates because you tend to use them as a sort of journal of Zeke. You tell us where you've been and what you've been doing to invariably delay site content updating :wink: If you wrote in your actually LJ more then maybe I wouldn't need these updates to know you are alive :mrgreen: I also like the random links you put in. They amuse me But as I said before, don't worry if you can't make one. We understand there is life outside of 5MV and you are one busy guy.

Just don't go and disappear completely, ok? People worry!

I concur entirely with Alexia's post.

[PointyHairedJedi]

Also, Zeke, as I've said before, a little more delegation of responsibility is no bad thing.

[Scooter]

Originally Posted by Zeke

No, I haven't. This has just been a very rough month for daily updates, especially the end. I was hit very hard and very fast by something this week and it's been all I could do since then to get the bare minimum done. I've been left seriously wondering if anything I do is worth it.

But I'll be making a newspost tonight, and I'll try to get back onto a daily schedule from then on. The daily updates aren't dead. I'm just wondering whether it would matter if they were.

I concur with Alexia's post (thanks Alexia!) and also PHJ's. 5MV matters to all of us -- it's the only site I visit other than the Onion that makes me laugh -- and more importantly you matter to us. Not because we want stuff from you but because we're grateful for everything you've already given us. Not only have you created laughter in the world, but you've inspired a lot of other people to do the same in emulation. Plus we've gotten to know you in a very e-Universe sort of way and I don't think there's a single person who's a part of the 5MV world who would not agree that you're good people.

I've been a one-man web-site before, and I've been daunted by how onerous it is and how people seem to want stuff from you all the time. But then you look back on how much came from the mustard seed of creating a little web site long ago, and you just sit back in amazement that you had anything to do with it at all.

Ask for help if you need it, take a break if you need it. Take a deep breath. Make some hot chocolate and talk to a dog for a while. That always works for me.

[evay]

^^everything he said.

[MaverickZer0]

Failing a dog, a cat, hamster, or algae eater (like some of us) works just as well.

I kinda understand anyways. I run a (little-known) site, and I have to beat myself in the head to remember to update more than once a month. Maybe you're just trying to do too much at once.

[Anonymous]

Maybe someone else can do the chores and let you just write

[Anonymous]

Zeke -- that was PERFECT. As soon as I read Jolene's latest comments, my first thought was "Robert Beltran." As George Carlin used to say, "If you don't like the weather, move!" I like the direction ENT is going -- finally. It's one thing for actors to be honest about their feelings (I hated it when the classic cast was so postive about ST:TFF when they all knew how bad it was, but Jolene needs to balance her criticism with a little more diplomacy.

Nice work Zeke. And 5MV rocks; always has!

Bob Gillis

[Anonymous]

Which direction is that. The whole Xindi thing sucked there I said it. Well it seems like they're getting more into the original stuff. Thank god.

[Anonymous]

Originally Posted by Kira

I...Which brings me to one of the most valid criticisms that Blalock could have put forward, yet doesn't appear to have done so: what possible excuse can the writers still fathom (other than at the whim of UPN execs on crack who think that catsuit=ratings) for NOT GIVING T'POL A UNIFORM? It was stupid before but she wasn't really part of the crew, so I could let it slide. But now, she has a commission. She's accepted the crew and her role on Enterprise. She's resigned from the Vulcan High Council. So why the @*$&# is she still in that catsuit? It drives me insane because it's such a stupidly obvious ploy for ratings, not to mention interferes with the T'Pol-is-becoming-more-human vibe they're trying to send out. Hopefully they'll eventually figure out that she looks better in uniform (see: "Twilight"; Seven of Nine; Deanna Troi) and that it would be more in character for her as a full-fledged member of the crew.

I have to agree with this. Seven was what I liked the least about Voyager and it's worse on Enterprise than ever. Enterprise lost me completely with the Rajiin/T'Pol scene. Rajiin was supposedly assaulting T'Pol telepathically, but it was blantantly gratuitous f/f sexploitation. I don't object to f/f scenes - I am, in fact, a bisexual woman - but get real, that was pure sleaze. I haven't watched Enterprise since.

The whole T&A thing is just a big cop-out. Supposedly, it's to draw male viewers and support the series, but if they put out good quality stories they wouldn't need so much of that nonsense - and they didn't on DS9. Oh sure, the dabo girls wore very revealing clothes, but how much screentime did they get compared to Seven or T'Pol? Even Leeta usually wore dresses that were less revealing than T'Pol's catsuit when they gave her a bigger role.

The whole decon thing told me where this was going. That was nonsense. A real decon should be something to drink to cleanse the system and a delousing, not people in their underwear rubbing gel on each other. That's so obviously nothing but sex it's downright silly.

One of these days the execs will realize that's there's all kinds of pics of nude women all over the internet and people who want to see stuff like that don't need to watch their shows to get it. They don't seem to have realized yet just how much the proliferation of nudity and porn online has de-valued this ploy. They're going to have to wise up soon, because T&A is becoming less of a rating draw all the time as people can easily find all of that they want online.

Let's face it, Enterprise doesn't get nearly as many viewers as Voyager or DS9 because so many people think it's boring and T'Pol's catsuit isn't enough to get them to watch. T&A worked for Voyager, but that was the early days of internet porn. Now home computers, as well as computers online in the workplace, are much more common and people can see all the female nudity and porn they want.

Simply put, they need to get back to producing good stories, without counting on a babe in a catsuit to make them money. And this requires them to not be so lazy as to leave loose ends all over the place or ignore those plot holes that are big enough for Godzilla to walk through. It would also help if the writers didn't ignore what they've written and contradict themselves all the time. Loyal viewers (hell, even casual viewers) remember this stuff and loyal viewers is supposed to be what they're after, right? They need to act like it if they expect to get them. I hope these lessons are learned soon, even if it has to be on SF shows unrelated to Trek.

[Anonymous]

[quote="mistshadow"]

Seven was what I liked the least about Voyager [quote]

*cough cough Nelix*

Maby the reason Seven was more popular was because she was an interesting character internet porn was plenty common at the time. I liked Seven she was cool she had really interesting developement. T'pol on the other hand has become an atempt to reuse an old consept. The sexy emotionless chick only works once then its just a rip off.

I'd also like to mention that towards the end of her time on voyager Kes wore an outfit not so different from Seven or Tpol's.

[Anonymous]

Originally Posted by mistshadow

The whole decon thing told me where this was going. That was nonsense. A real decon should be something to drink to cleanse the system and a delousing, not people in their underwear rubbing gel on each other. That's so obviously nothing but sex it's downright silly

A drink no. The blue light is fine if its purpose is to burn off a layer of skin. In real life decontamination the people are nude so the underwear is actually more clothing then is reasonable. There could be some chemical agents (I think thats what the gel is suposed to be). Decon should really be a tube of some sort not a big stand up multi person chamber. And by the way there are no lice in space.

[Anonymous]

[quote="Pat"][quote="mistshadow"]

Seven was what I liked the least about Voyager

*cough cough Nelix*

Maby the reason Seven was more popular was because she was an interesting character internet porn was plenty common at the time. I liked Seven she was cool she had really interesting developement. T'pol on the other hand has become an atempt to reuse an old consept. The sexy emotionless chick only works once then its just a rip off.

I'd also like to mention that towards the end of her time on voyager Kes wore an outfit not so different from Seven or Tpol's.

Internet porn may have been common, but access to it in the home wasn't quite so common yet. I myself didn't have a home computer until Voyager's seventh season and I know plenty of people who were just getting one when Enterprise came out.

Interesting character development - okay, some of it was interesting (but some of it was also laughable at times, both scientifically and plot-wise). But no matter how much character development you try to pile on the eye candy, that's all it is really when the character is a babe in a catsuit. Think about it. They (including Jeri Ryan herself) always talked like the character development made up for the blatant sexploitation, but the character development also results in more screentime with the babe in a catsuit and heels. What a coincidence. And yes, Kes did wear a similar outfit towards the end. And she was gone as soon as they got another attractive woman (with bigger breasts) to wear revealing clothes for them. And you're right, it is reusing a concept either way, so it's even a cheaper tactic than ever.

Ok, so delousing wasn't the correct term. I'm sure you can figure out what I mean. Either a chemical cleansing spray/mist or a soap to use in the shower would work, not people in their underwear spreading gel on each other. But they can't show enough using the latter technique, so they came up with that. It' still silly and very obvious.

What's sad is that they just don't get it. It's the obvious and frankly sleazy sexploitation that is Enterprise's biggest weakness, not it's strength. They've used it so much that lots pf people think that's all there is to the show. And with rather weak storylines, plot holes and loose ends floating around eveyrwhere, how far from wrong are they? Like I said, they lost me with Rajiin. If they'd done a f/f scene with some class, I'd have been praising them, but that was tasteless. It's not like they can't do f/f now, they did it for years on Buffy. The execs think they can get more ratings with this stuff, but it's working the other way around now. People don't need tv shows for that anymore. They want good stories again and the execs are delivering more eye candy instead.

[Anonymous]

Okay T'pol has become ridiculus I just wanna defend Seven. Surly she was not worse then Nelix. See the reason she is sexy is becaue she has to be reminiscent of the borg queen. And the reason the borg queen is sexy is because it makes her all the more sinister. It no big deal for a show to have a bit of sex apeal. So thats my defense of Seven. Cause she was cool. Granted decon is rather dumb. I think thats why they stopped showing it

[Anonymous]

I think of all the "growing to be human" stories we've seen on Trek, Seven and The Doctor were the most interesting and touching.

[Anonymous]

I think so to but it requires proper context. T'pol is just a vulcan. Vulcan's are not somehow infirior to humans. I'd like to see some humans become more alien. Instead of them learning from us how about us learning from them. That was at one point a bit of T'pol's persona atleast in Sleeping Dogs. She taught Hoshi how to overcome here fears through vulcan meditation. A very nice scene might I add.