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Old 06-17-2003, 09:29 PM
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[color=#000000ost_uid0]I was just thinking about what Enterprise could use from other Star Trek series, to improve continuity. I just thought of one. The distress beakon from TNG 2x18 Up The Long Ladder. It was in general use from 2123 until 2190. That's the Enterprise time-period. I know it's just a small thing, but it'd be fun.

Can anyone think of any others?[/colorost_uid0]
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Old 06-17-2003, 11:30 PM
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[color=#000000ost_uid0][quoteost_uid0]I was just thinking about what Enterprise could use from other Star Trek series, to improve continuity. [/quoteost_uid0]

I can think of a few things from other Trek series that it shouldn't have used...

Griping aside, early Trek continuity is a bit screwed up, since contributions have been made to it over a 40-year timespan, and 'real' history is already starting to impinge on fake history. I must have missed the Eugenics Wars and not been paying attention when they launched Voyager 6.

Some Orions would be nice. If the Gorn show up, and then everyone "forgets" about them until Kirk's time, I'm going to suggest that Archer's Enterprise didn't bother to bring along any recording devices at all.[/colorost_uid0]
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Old 06-18-2003, 07:57 AM
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[color=#000000ost_uid0][bost_uid0]Archer:[/bost_uid0] Captains log...
[bost_uid0]T'Pol:[/bost_uid0] Captain, you do know we don't have any recording devices with us?
[bost_uid0]Archer:[/bost_uid0] We don't? What have I been talking into all year?
[bost_uid0]T'Pol:[/bost_uid0] A spoon.
[bost_uid0]Archer:[/bost_uid0] Why didn't anyone tell me before?
[bost_uid0]T'Pol:[/bost_uid0] We thought it was kind of amusing, actually.[/colorost_uid0]

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Old 06-18-2003, 01:44 PM
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[color=#000000ost_uid0]You uninformed critics! Don't you know that, in the fourth season, just after Q helps them fend off the Borg-Dominion alliance, they discover that they were actually transported into a parallel universe in "Broken Bow"?[/colorost_uid0]
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Old 06-18-2003, 02:35 PM
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[color=#000000ost_uid0]Damn, I must have missed that one. I already knew they were in a the parallel universe, but I thought it was caused by the Temporal Cold War.[/colorost_uid0]
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Old 06-18-2003, 05:00 PM
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[color=#000000ost_uid0]Well, I've often thought that they could get around the sub-space radio blooper by implying that they're using a Vulcan sub-space net rather than having the equipment on [iost_uid0]Enterprise[/iost_uid0] itself.

I think seeing some stuff from Earth's past might be good too. It's only been a hundered-odd years since WWIII, so it would be interesting to see the crew dealing with the consequences of that in some way. So far it's been more or less completely ignored.

EDIT: The inclusion of the [iost_uid0]Daedalus[/iost_uid0]-class ships at some point would be a nice idea too.[/colorost_uid0]

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Old 06-18-2003, 05:48 PM
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[color=#000000ost_uid0]What about the photon torpedos they suddenly have? Hell, what about the modern form of the ship, more than Kirk's Enterprise?[/colorost_uid0]
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Old 06-18-2003, 06:07 PM
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[color=#000000ost_uid0]Or a laser cannon?[/colorost_uid0]
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Old 06-18-2003, 09:14 PM
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[quoteost_uid0="PointyHairedJedi"][color=#000000ost_uid0]EDIT: The inclusion of the [iost_uid0]Daedalus[/iost_uid0]-class ships at some point would be a nice idea too.[/colorost_uid0][/quoteost_uid0]
[color=#000000ost_uid0]Chronology on the [iost_uid0]Daedalus[/iost_uid0] class is vague, at best. One of the best I've run across, and one I personally like, states that they were produced in large numbers as battle platforms for the Earth-Romulan War, which means that we [iost_uid0]could[/iost_uid0] conceivably see them on ENT at some point.[/colorost_uid0]
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Old 06-19-2003, 03:55 AM
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[color=#000000ost_uid0]Personally I think Enterprise could use a little more originality, not less.[/colorost_uid0]
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Old 06-19-2003, 05:42 AM
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[color=#000000ost_uid0]Originality is fine, as long as it doesn't screw up the time-line.

BTW: I think Enterprise has been pretty original so far.[/colorost_uid0]
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Old 06-19-2003, 07:06 AM
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[color=#000000ost_uid0]It's original, but it has way too many things it's not supposed to have yet. Earth is not supposed to make first contact with the Ferengi untill TNG, but the Suliban are great, and they're still at war with the Klingons, just like they should, according to TOS. I think anyway, I don't watch TOS.[/colorost_uid0]
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Old 06-19-2003, 07:39 AM
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[color=#000000ost_uid0][quoteost_uid0]It's original, but it has way too many things it's not supposed to have yet. [/quoteost_uid0]

Well, they've had a ripoff of Star Trek VI, a ripoff of 11:59, the standard Shuttle Crash Episode (several), the Mysterious Virus Episode, the Transporter Malfunction Episode, the Holodeck Episode (something else they shouldn't have), and probably several more which I'd recognize if I watched the show.

[quoteost_uid0]and they're still at war with the Klingons, just like they should, according to TOS. [quoteost_uid0]

According to TOS, they shouldn't even know the Klingons (and said Klingons should look like Mongols, but that's a whole other thread). My Star Trek Encyclopedia says that first contact with the Klingon Empire was made in 2218, long after the Federation was founded. The Earth-Romulan War should occur at the end of the series.

The Earth-Xindi war doesn't seem to appear in any historical records, oddly enough.[/colorost_uid0]
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Old 06-19-2003, 08:25 AM
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[color=#000000ost_uid0]Yes, it's a shame continuity isn't 'air-tight' with Enterprise, but I still think they've done a great job. There wouldn't be much of a serie without the klingons, the ferengi, a transporter, etc. They've got to have something to use. They can only try to minimize the damage.

And who knows, maybe at the end, in the last season perhaps, somehow the entire temporal cold war will be prevented and a lot of the things that didn't make sense, like the borg, will be prevented as well.[/colorost_uid0]
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Old 06-19-2003, 11:59 AM
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[color=#000000ost_uid0]Exactly. Time travelling can cause a lot of problems, but it can solve (continuity) problems too.
There's just one problem that's never going to be solved. If you try to change history because something went wrong, you can never succeed, because if you do, it wouldn't go wrong, so you wouldn't want to change anything. Then it does go wrong, and you change it, etc. etc... :eyeroll:[/colorost_uid0]
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Old 06-19-2003, 12:09 PM
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[color=#000000ost_uid0] Gotta love a temporal paradox!

But to quote Daniƫls:

[quoteost_uid0]You're thinking of time travel like Enterprise is some H.G. Wells novel. It's not. It's far more complicated. There's no way for you to understand.[/quoteost_uid0]

By the way, there wouldn't be any good movies or episodes about time travel if they had to avoid temporal paradoxes like this. I mean, Back To The Future [bost_uid0]rules[/bost_uid0], but it's full of such mistakes. And do you know the serie Early Edition? Some guy gets tomorrow's newspaper today, so he can prevent disasters, etc. Besides the fact that that newspaper would eventually forget how to print bad news, every disaster that guy prevents could never have been printed, so he could never have prevented it.[/colorost_uid0]

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Old 06-19-2003, 12:24 PM
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[color=#000000ost_uid0]But the paper says what [iost_uid0]would[/iost_uid0] happen if Gary doesn't do anything about it. Or something. That's how I picture it anyway. Because as soon as someone (especially other that Gary) looks at the paper, it changes.

And [iost_uid0]Back to the Future[/iost_uid0] isn't as full of temporal paradoxes as [iost_uid0]Star Trek[/iost_uid0]. Of course it isn't as good as [iost_uid0]Star Trek[/iost_uid0] either.
Would that mean temporal paradoxes are good? :O[/colorost_uid0]
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Old 06-19-2003, 12:43 PM
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[color=#000000ost_uid0][quoteost_uid0]But the paper says what would happen if Gary doesn't do anything about it. Or something. That's how I picture it anyway. Because as soon as someone (especially other that Gary) looks at the paper, it changes.[/quoteost_uid0]

It's Tomorrow's newspaper. That means, whatever is going to be printed on tomorrow's paper, that's what's in it. If you change something (like prevent a disaster), that disaster won't be printed tomorrow, and therefor, should never have been in Gary's paper.

[quoteost_uid0]And Back to the Future isn't as full of temporal paradoxes as Star Trek. Of course it isn't as good as Star Trek either.
Would that mean temporal paradoxes are good? :O[/quoteost_uid0]

You got it! [/colorost_uid0]
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Old 06-19-2003, 01:03 PM
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[color=#000000ost_uid0]I actually read a Gregory Benford novel called [iost_uid0]Timescape[/iost_uid0] that was all about people changing the past to prevent a global disaster by sending messages back using nutrinos or something. The explanation for getting round the paradox that might have ensued was actually very good and made sense - it was quite Trousers of Time-ish though.[/colorost_uid0]
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Old 06-19-2003, 01:19 PM
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[color=#000000ost_uid0]I don't know that novel. What was the explanation?

I'll try to guess though. I've thought about this whole paradox thing a lot.

If you (lets call him you_1) send a message back to your past self (lets call him you_2), to prevent a disaster, you_1 shouldn't only send that message, but you_1 should also tell you_2 to send the exact same message back in time to you_3, even though you_2 already prevented the disaster. Then you_3 becomes you_2 and you_2 becomes you_1 and it starts all over, without a temporal paradox.

lol, am I making any sense?[/colorost_uid0]

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