The Dicer is Coming!

[NAHTMMM]

Originally Posted by Nate the Great

Well, I hope you enjoyed the dicers!

That I did! Thanks for sharing It's interesting to look at the creative processes of various people and to see how stuff looked before it became the stuff you know it as. Or something like that. Also the comments should be helpful for critiquing my "fanver" drafts.


(P.S. I didn't specify what I was guessing earlier because I wanted to leave it for others to figure out on their own.)

[Nate the Great]

Well, I don't think we need to put fanver in quotes, but okay...

Anyone else?

[NAHTMMM]

Originally Posted by Nate the Great

As another sign that I was a newbie fivist (does newbist or nevist sound better?)

I'd stick with "newbie fivist".

Yet another instance of my early frailty of referencing plot points that come from nowhere just for the sake of including as much of it as possible. The fact that Kataan is a desert world is absolutely superfluous when you have to chop out plot points to fit the fiver format.

This sort of thing trips me up a lot. Especially problematic since I tend to go after novels, where the writer can include a lot more in the way of charaterization/throwaway lines/filler than can be fit into a TV episode. Good to be reminded that I don't have to squeeze everything in.

“I’m trying to create a moment here!” is still a favorite line.

As it should be.

Kamin: The world is doomed!
Administrator: I know that. We’re doing all we can.
Kamin: How? We can only launch small missiles!
Administrator: Quit nitpicking or I will fire you!

Nate: Although my final version of this scene is better, this version still holds a special place in my heart if only for the nitpicking gag. Although (speaking of nitpicking), why didn’t I say “I’ll fire you!”?

I don't know, why would you?

Originally Posted by Nate the Great

Picard: What is that Mr. Data?
Data: A probe that appears to be attempting a dialup connection with your brain, sir.
Picard: Yeah, right, as if they could be Windows compatible!
Probe: Wanna bet?
Picard: Yeazzzzz.....

Nate: My only regret in this scene is that comma between “yeah” and “right.” I was going for sarcasm, not casual wit.

I agree that the comma softens the delivery, but I think I originally interpreted the line as sarcasm.

Eline: Kamin, you're awake!
Picard/Kamin: Who are you? Computer, end program!
Eline: Who is Computer? I'm Eline, your wife.
Kamin: Yeah, right, in my dreams my wife is a knockout redhead. Where am I?
Eline: Your home, of course.
Kamin: This dump? I'm gonna leave before you start going all Castle Anthrax on me!

Nate: The “who is Computer?” gag seems a little weak in retrospect. At least, it’s not strong enough to justify being the second gag in a long (for a fiver) scene.

Eh, it works for me.

At least the “knockout redhead wife” gag works on two levels. The first level is my original intent, his Nexus wife from Generations. It works for Beverly Crusher, too, if you happen to be a shipper, which I am. Everyone can see whatever meaning they want.

I'd forgotten about the wife in Generations being a redhead, personally, so I'm glad you explained you didn't necessarily mean Beverly.

Batai: I am going to change careers yet again! I'm going to be a musician!
Kamin: Fine, the world is ending anyway!
Meribor: So I shouldn't marry Dannik, I should just live with him?
Kamin: Not in a million years!
Meribor: But you just said...
Kamin: Hush, you!

Nate: See, the scene has more punch when you hold a focus with the plotline! My only regret is the overuse of exclamation points, but I’m not sure if periods would do the gags justice.

The exclamation points don't really detract from the scene for me, personally.

Kamin: The world is doomed! You can fire me with a hefty pension for insanity now.
Administrator: Not on your life. First of all, you're right, and second of all we like to keep our insane elected officials where we can see them.
Kamin: But isn't a system of government like that doomed to failure?
Administrator: You'd think so, but it's not. Now go away before I take your flute.

Nate: I remember being very proud of this “insane elected officials” business. At the time I thought it incredibly witty.

It sounds familiar somehow. Is it a reference?

Eline: Put your shoes away.
Kamin: You pick those as your last...
Eline: Ack!
Kamin: Drat.

Nate: See? Same scene! Should’ve used “rats,” though.

I think "drat" works quite well.

Meribor: Want to go see the new missile get launched?
Kamin: Why would I want to do that? My skin protector is only 500 SPF!
Eline: That doesn't matter. This is all an illusion anyway.
Kamin: Eline? How can you be here?
Eline: Turns out my contract entitled me to one more scene. Remember us.

Nate: Further proof that we’re our own worst critics. I now consider that 500 SPF joke pathetically weak.

It should probably have another 0 in it.

I’m proud of the Eline’s contract gag, though.

That part's certainly an improvement over the rough draft.

[Nate the Great]

Administrator: Quit nitpicking or I will fire you!
Administrator: Quit nitpicking or I'll fire you!

See the difference, actually...

Administrator: Quit nitpicking or I'll fire you and break your flute!
Kamin: Waaaaaa!

Yeah, yeah, I know, Picard would never whine. It's a fun mental image, though.

"Yeah, right..." implies a pause, as though Picard is casually tossing it off as he turns back from the screen to Riker. "Yeah right" is more of a bark, as Picard still looks at the screen.

See, dicers serve a purpose! "In my dreams" immediately brought me to the Nexus, which is a dream world by definition. I suppose Picard COULD dream of Beverly in his real dreams, but somehow I would think that he'd be disciplined enough not to lust after his best friend's wife even in his dreams. Then again, I wouldn't put it past his to subconsciously transmogrify Beverly into that Nexus wife as a way of figuratively having his cake and eat it too, without feelings of guilt. How's THAT for psychiatry?

The insane elected officials business is probably an amalgam of several influences, including the hefty pensions that even unsucessful Presidents get.

[Chancellor Valium]

"I will" has more emphasis?

I like "drat", too. It sounds so impotent - it really suits the scene, IMNERHO.

Interesting stuff.

[Nate the Great]

Oh well....

Anyone care to see a dicer of my Manhunt fiver? I have a first draft of that one, too.

[Wowbagger]

That sounds entertaining. Please do. I promise to read it within eight months.

Anyhow, I wanted to congratulate Zeke on making 2800 posts. He'd better not respond to this, because then he'd be at 2801 and that would ruin it.

And yes, I do drop in at random times every few months. Just to make sure that, despite appearances, this site is: Not. Dead.

[Nate the Great]

Wow, you're still using 5MV. I admit that even now I have to force myself to say 5M.net.

Well, "dead" might be a tad strong. "Coma'ed" might be better. After all, the site still thinks it's winter.

I forgot to ask about IMNERHO. What does that mean?

[PointyHairedJedi]

Interesting, Nate, very interesting. I don't know that the term dicer will catch on in this particular context though, it sounds too much like something would would see for sale in an infomercial.

[Chancellor Valium]

Originally Posted by Nate the Great

I forgot to ask about IMNERHO. What does that mean?

"In My Never Even Remotely Humble Opinion".

[Nate the Great]

I said in the first post that dicers had nothing to do with infomercial cutlery, but let's see you come up with a better word.

[mudshark]

Originally Posted by PointyHairedJedi

Interesting, Nate, very interesting. I don't know that the term dicer will catch on in this particular context though, it sounds too much like something would would see for sale in an infomercial.

"Yes, Jason -- your troubles are over! It's the NEW Friday the 13th MARK V, by RONCO! It slices! It dices! It mashes! It even maims!" [/cheesyTVannouncer]

[Nate the Great]

Here's a short list of alternatives to dicer:

Group One: "director's commentary fiver"

directver
direcer
direcomver

Group Two: "commentary fiver"

commever
commentiver

Group Three: "annotated fiver"

annover
annoter

Group Four: miscellaneous

balconyver (think Statler and Waldorf)
mistver (think MST)

Actually, looking at the options, commentiver looks like it might be the easiest to use and remember. Directver looks a bit forced.

[PointyHairedJedi]

...What's wrong with just 'director's commentary'?

[Nate the Great]

It's boring, that's what's wrong with it!

[Nate the Great]

Does anyone else care to make a dicer or two? I'd particularly like to hear Zeke tell us how he created the first fiver without any prior experience.

[NAHTMMM]

I would be interested, but I haven't done any "official" fivers, and I imagine that doing a dicer for my novel fivers would just involve tacking on even MORE (deleted) scenes (Yes, Peter Jackson, I know you don't see anything wrong with that ), and so . . . sorry, not me.


Oh, and I second (doubly so, even) the special request for Zeke.

[Nate the Great]

So here's my dicer for Manhunt.

Part One: The Original Draft

Captain's Log: Today we get to escort two giant frozen fish-sticks to a peace conference. And I thought that grocery stores didn't deliver anymore....

The hyphen in fishstick confuses me, even though I put it there. Today I'd have stuck with the much simpler "two giant fishsticks." The "frozen" is implied.

Pulaski: The Antedean delegates are fine, sir.
Picard: Excellent.
Wesley: Why can't we just replicate some fish for them?
Picard: Apparently they think that replicated fish tastes too "fishy," somehow.

Ugh, that's lame. Replicated fish tasting too fishy. I could claim some sort of two-level joke, with the second layer playing on the use of "fishy" to mean "suspicious," but I'm not sure I was that clever back then.

Worf: We're being hailed, sir.
Pilot: Help me! I've been trapped in a small shuttle with an insane woman for three days!
Lwaxana: Hi there! I'm here to make the episode interesting!
Riker: Is that a good thing?
Troi: Better than talking to fishsticks all day.
Riker: That's debatable.

I love the pilot's exasperation, but once again, I fell victim to the fault of making fun of the plot and/or the fiving process to attempt to create a joke. I think Riker's dialogue is great, though.

Lwaxana: Please carry my luggage, Jean-Luc.
Riker: I'll do it.
Picard: Why?
Riker: I've sworn to protect you, and that thing is so heavy that it set off the mass-overload alarm on this panel.

Nice joke, but I took too long getting to the punchline.

Lwaxana: Don't forget about the ambassadorial dinner tonight, Jean-Luc.
Picard: So I have to wear my dress uniform three different times in one day, plus I get to have dinner with you? This must be my lucky day.
Lwaxana: I'm sensing sarcasm, Captain.
Picard: I'm sure that it's the pain from Riker's arms about to fall off that's distracting you.

Here I work in the ever-useful gag of a Betazoid stating the obvious, plus the classic sarcastic lucky day puchline. Hey, don't replace what ain't broke.

Wesley: She said that the Captain had great legs?
Riker: That wasn't in this fiver.
Wesley: I read the Director's Cut, not the theatrical release.
Data: Impressive.

I love the sheer presumption of the Director's Cut. In my opinion, over ninety percent of films should be the "director's cut" when it's released in the first place. Studios should trust the director's vision, or else get a director they can trust. I distinctly remember the commentary for an old movie, where the head of the studio told the director in essence, "here's the plot I want you to film. You have X dollars to do it and I want it out on date Y. Good luck," and the director would go and make the movie. Hence the theatrical release WAS the director's cut.

Picard: Are you coming to dinner with the other officers, Doctor?
Pulaski: I'm not a bridge officer.
Picard: Sorry, I keep forgetting about that.
Pulaski: Actually the writer of the original script did.

Actually, I don't know if the original writer did or not, but it was an obvious joke. Then again, I kinda got the feeling that even though Pulaski was a senior officer, she wasn't a bridge officer. Remember that you have to pass a test to advance to Commander as a doctor. Pulaski might've never taken the test that Troi later did.

Picard: I brought a bottle of ale for Ambassador Troi.
Homn: (Nod).
Picard: You're going to drink that, aren't you?
Homn: (Nod).
Picard: I can't exactly say that I blame you, given
your job.
Homn: (Nod).

I love Homn's character. He's so awesome. Hey, when a guy can only say one line in canon Trek and one in a novel and still be memorable, he's got style. All I know is that if I worked for Lwaxana Troi, Daughter of the Fifth House, Holder of the Sacred Chalice of Rixx, and Heir to the Holy Rings of Betazed, I'D have a drinking problem.

Pulaski: So the Captain is having dinner with your mother, and this is a bad thing?
Troi: Yes.
Pulaski: Why?
Troi: Because it's creepy!
Pulaski: Ah.

Okay, this one crossed the barrier into uncharacteristic behavior. Then again, maybe not. Troi does sound a little whiny, but that was probably my intention.

Lwaxana: I like Earth men.
Picard: That's great.
Lwaxana: I want you to--
Picard: Sorry, but we're running out of time and we
have to move on to the next scene. Picard to Data.
Data: Aye, sir.

Ugh! There I go again, using the fiving process make a gag so I could skip scenes! I was SUCH a nevist!

Data: So, to sum up, I'm the most boring guy in existence.
Picard: Thank you, Mr. Data. My my, look at the time!
Data: How does one look at a nonphysical quantity?
Picard: We only have five minutes to tell the story, Data.
Data: For that matter, how does one own a...

I know that Data is literal, but perhaps I overdid his naivete a little too much here.

Picard: Your mother is a lousy telepath.
Troi: Hey, just because she's hitting on you, it doesn't mean that she's crazy!
Riker: Isn't that the opposite of the point that you made a few scenes ago?
Troi: How did you know about that?
Riker: Wesley loaned me his copy of the Director's Cut.

I don't even know if the point is opposite or not, but it won't be the first or the last time a fivist has retconned previous scenes to make a joke. Besides, anytime I can reuse prior gags is good. I got that from Schoolhouse Rock, amongst other places.

Picard: Computer, activate Dixon Hill program.
Computer: I need more information.
Picard: I don't want to bore the readers. You figure it out.
Computer: I'll get you for that.

Sentient computers are fun, but here it is again; skipping stuff and joking about how I'm skipping it. Sheesh, nevist alert!

Madeline: I want my paycheck!
Gangster: And I want to shoot you!
Picard: Computer, freeze program!
Computer: Yeah, right.

So the computer gets back at Picard. Lame scene, though.

Lwaxana: Where's the captain?
Troi: Busy.
Lwaxana: Then I'll propose to Riker.
Troi: Let me revise my previous answer.

THIS is classic. Hey, you can't throw gutterballs all the time, eh?

Pulaski: The Antedeans are waking up. Too bad it's not important enough to warrant a full scene, at least by fiver standards.
Worf: Agreed.

And again. We all know why this was chucked. Let's move on.

Riker: Trouble, sir. Mrs. Troi thinks that she's engaged to me.
Picard: Oh, I'm sure that Rex here will be glad to take her off your hands.
Rex: Whoa, whoa, hold your horses!
Riker: She's beautiful and rich.
Rex: I retract my last statement.

I never noticed before that I reused the "let me change my answer" gag. Had I seen that, I would've used it more often in this fiver. I still love Rex's shallow nature, though. You could even call him dim, if you don't mind an AWFUL hologram joke.

Lwaxana: What a messy room you have here, Jean-Luc! Except for the hunk behind the counter, of course.
Rex: What's a dame like you doing in a dump like this?
Lwaxana: I find that line predictable and trite. Good thing I like that in a man.
Picard: Should I be offended?

I consider those last two lines to be one of the best couplets I've ever written for a fiver.

Lwaxana: Rex and I are getting married!
Data: Query, why was I not able to do my South American bit and show off my nifty zoot suit?
Picard: Data, this is a fiver. All plot threads are considered superflous unless they can be turned into a joke.
Data: If I were human, I believe the correct response would be "smeg."

Ha ha. Smeg. I swear I've never seen an episode of Red Dwarf in my life, I picked that up from the folks over at 5MSG. I love it. Too bad I felt it necessary to make fun of dropping plot points again.

Lwaxana: Even though I'm steamed at you for setting me up with a hologram, I'll still save your butts and tell you that the Antedeans are assassins.
Picard: Thank you, Mrs. Troi.
Homn: Thank you for the drinks.
Picard: Why would you waste your one line in a fiver repeating what you said in the actual episode?
Homn: (Shrug).
Picard: Whatever, just go away. Hopefully I'll get to do some actual "boldly going" ONE of these weeks.
Homn: (Nod).

Yikes, that's a long scene. I suppose this is the genesis of the "shut up and go away" joke I used in my "In the Cards" fiver. Still a classic.

[Nate the Great]

Part Two: The Final Draft

Captain's Log: Today we get to escort two giant frozen fish sticks to a peace conference. And I thought that grocery stores didn't deliver anymore....
Pulaski: The Antedean delegates are fine, sir.
Picard: Excellent, Doctor.
Wesley: What's in the barrel?
Pulaski: It's fish for their wake-up snack. They think that replicated fish tastes a little too fishy, somehow.

Okay, same basic jokes, but fleshed out.

Worf: We're being hailed, sir.
Pilot: Help me! I've been trapped in a small shuttle with an insane woman for three days!
Lwaxana: Hi there!
Picard: What did we do to deserve the --
Data: She has full ambassadorial status, sir.
Picard: -- honour of your visit? Ahem.

The sudden change of direction gag is a classic.

Lwaxana: Please carry my luggage, Jean-Luc.
Riker: I'll do it.
Picard: Why?
Riker: I've sworn to protect you, and that thing is so heavy that it set off the mass-overload alarm on this panel.

Hey, that looks familiar!

Lwaxana: Don't forget about the ambassadorial dinner tonight, Jean-Luc.
Picard: So I have to wear my dress uniform three different times in one day, plus I get to have dinner with you? This must be my lucky day.
Lwaxana: I'm sensing sarcasm, Captain.
Picard: I'm sure that it's the pain from Riker's arms about to fall off that's distracting you.

Wow, so does that!

Wesley: She said that the Captain had great legs?
Riker: That wasn't in this fiver.
Wesley: I read the Director's Cut, not the theatrical release.

Simplified for better humor value. Plus we in fiverland who never watch episodes (if there are any) now know that Picard has great legs. Supposedly. Not that I'd know. Honestly.

Picard: Are you coming to dinner, Doctor?
Pulaski: I already ate, Captain.
Picard: Why does that send a shiver down my spine?

Hey look, the captain's precognisant!

Picard: I brought a bottle of ale for Ambassador Troi.
Homn: (nod)
Picard: You're going to drink that, aren't you?
Homn: (nod)
Picard: I can't exactly say that I blame you, given your job.
Homn: (nod)

Gotta love Homn.

Pulaski: I just saw the captain going towards your mother's quarters.
Troi: How do you know where my mother's quarters are?
Pulaski: When I was reattaching Commander Riker's arm he told me about the suitcase holes leading to it.
Troi: This might be trouble, given her current medical condition. She's in the Phase.
Pulaski: I've heard of it. An anti-menopausal woman and a straightlaced starship captain. I'd pay for tickets to that dinner.

Wow, I'd forgotten about these new gags. Hey, Z, did I really write those? The final punchline seems like me, though.

Lwaxana: I like Earth men. Already I feel like we have a spiritual connection.
Picard: That's great.
Lwaxana: I want you to --
Picard: -- call Data for some after-dinner conversation?
Lwaxana: Um, yes?

Anything that makes Lwaxana Troi, DOTFH, HOTSCOR, & HTTHROB speechless, is a VERY good thing.

Data: So, to sum up, I'm the most boring guy in existence.
Picard: Thank you, Mr. Data. My my, look at the time!
Data: How does one look at a nonphysical quantity?

Marc was right that two punchlines aren't required for this gag.

Picard: Your mother is a lousy telepath.
Troi: Hey, just because she's hitting on you, it doesn't mean that she's crazy!
Riker: Isn't that the opposite of the point that you made a few scenes ago?
Troi: How did you know about that?
Riker: Wesley loaned me his copy of the Director's Cut.

It's quite a leap from "lousy telepath" to "crazy," isn't it? Then again...

Picard: Computer, activate Dixon Hill program.
Computer: You're on duty.
Picard: I'm doing my duty by protecting my sanity. You wouldn't want to be commanded by an captain who'd been driven insane by an anti-menopausal ambassador, would you?
Computer: You're talking to a computer. Your sanity is debatable.

I'm still unsure where I came up with "anti-menopausal" as the easiest catchall description of Lwaxana's condition. I should've nominated "You're talking to a computer, your sanity is debatable" in the "fiver punchlines in real life" thread.

Madeline: Hey, Dix. We really need some dough. At least I do.
Picard: I'll try to find a case (after I'm done loafing, that is).
Madeline: Say what, Dix?
Picard: Darn textual scenes!

It suddenly strikes me that Picard's puncline should've been in parentheses as well. Just to give Madeline something else to hear.

Lwaxana: Where's the captain?
Troi: Busy.
Lwaxana: Then I'll propose to Riker.
Troi: Let me revise my previous answer.

And again, don't mess with what ain't broke.

Pulaski: The Antedeans are waking up. You should tell the captain, Commander.
Riker: Of course.
Data: Can I put my zoot suit on first?
Riker: Who said you're -- oh, never mind. Anything to get away from Ambassador Troi.

I love the phrase "zoot suit." Zoot suit. Zoot suit. Zoot suit.

Riker: Trouble, sir. Mrs. Troi thinks that she's engaged to me.
Picard: Oh, I'm sure that our holographic bartender Rex here will be happy to take her off your hands.
Rex: Whoa, whoa, hold your horses!
Riker: She's beautiful and rich.
Rex: I retract my last statement.

Marc said that I should add "holographic bartender" to help those unfamiliar with the episode, simular to giving Picard and Kamin joint credit for Kamin's first line in my Inner Light fiver. Whatever.

Lwaxana: What a messy room you have here, Jean-Luc!
Except for the hunk behind the counter, of course.
Rex: What's a dame like you doing in a dump like this?
Lwaxana: I find that line predictable and trite. Good thing I like that in a man.
Picard: Should I be offended?

Should Lwaxana really be looking for someone who's predicable and trite, anyway?

Lwaxana: Rex and I are getting married!
Data: A telepath marrying a hologram. Query: Does this qualify as a joke?
Picard: Data, anything that ties up plot threads in a fiver qualifies as a joke.
Riker: As long as I don't have to marry her, you can call it anything you like.

This self-referential gag works because it's funny.

Lwaxana: The Antedeans are assassins. They want to blow up the conference.
Antedean: That's slander! Or is it libel, since we're in a fiver?
Data: Their robes are lined with explosives, sir.
Picard: Mr. Worf, take them away. They'll have plenty of time to debate the subject.

I'm sure I wasn't the first to do the slander/libel gag, but that doesn't mean that's it's not great.

Picard: Thank you, Mrs. Troi.
Lwaxana: Until next time, Captain. I'll make sure it's even more exciting, if you know what I mean.
Homn: Thank you for the drinks.
Picard: You used your one line on that?
Homn: (shrug)
(The Enterprise flees from Ambassador Troi at Ludicrous Speed)

There we go. Another dicer done. This is the only other fiver I had a first draft saved for, so any further dicers will have to be final draft only. Maybe I could remember past versions of gags, though.

[AKAArzosah]

I think the last line should have been (nod) again, but otherwise, all good!

I even changed my signature, observe: